Throughout history, stories have been told of great heroes who have triumphed, but these brave souls rarely do not have help achieving their greatness. Heroes always need help, they must learn how to defeat the darkness, and they must learn from the best, they need a mentor to succeed. Usually it is an old wise man, or in Grendel’s case, an old wise dragon. Greedy about his gold, Grendel encounters an old dragon with amazing theories that I can barely understand and an odd sense of humor. Only wanting a simply wanting an answer, Grendel receives a lot more than what he bargained for. The dragon instead of giving Grendel a straight answer begins on discussing, or more accurately talking at Grendel, about his abilities and his different theories of the universe. Trying to follow along, Grendel is told that dragons could see the future. They perceive it just like how we perceive the past and present. “…We see from the mountaintop: all time, all space…” Dragons can only see the future but they cannot change it. Even if one was to act on a random impulse, they still do what they originally saw. We humans and Grendel can only “think what we think”. We operate in “tunnel vision” where we do not perceive or understand everything that is happening around us. For us, sharpers are our “saviors”, they provide us an illusion, they mend our “useless” facts together, and create a connection, which is what we as a species spend our whole life doing; creating connections that are simply not there. Grendel defines us. By making us think, create, and confront him it helps us “create us”. By interacting with Grendel he drives us to learn what we are, we make up stories of where he comes from, what he is made of, and why he is here. While we are creating the mystery of Grendel, we are solving the mystery of who we are. This and the dragon’s other multitude of theories are truly fascinating. While the dragon is discretely answering Grendel’s questions, he is also providing Grendel and the readers with an amazing question of who are we? And, what is our purpose?
5. This Chapter really opened my eyes in terms of Grendel’s education about the world. It seems to me that Grendel has his own mentor, a wise dragon who has been around long enough to help Grendel understand the difference between the truth, and a twisted tail told by the likes of the Shaper. Grendel seems to also have a form ADHD. What I mean by this is when the dragon begins to talk about the forms of chaos men can cause he begins to become uninterested. The dragon says he only is interested in the hunt and killing. That’s understandable because that’s all he has been around his entire life, and he’s had to fight to survive in this world dominated by man. Grendel also learns a lesson he had never understood before. When he saw the dragon, he became over powered by fear and all he could do was stare. With the unexpected help of the dragon, Grendel realized the true terror of coming face to face with a force no one understands. Hopefully, this encounter has opened his eyes to why he is feared throughout the land. ~Ben Moseley
Chapter five recounts Grendel’s encounter with the mighty dragon. The dragon greets Grendel as if he were an expected guest, claiming to possess complete knowledge of the universe’s past, future, and present. Upon meeting the dragon Grendel feels the sensation of fear for one of first times in his life. The dragon is not only much larger than Grendel, with great tusks and claws, but also spews hot fire from his mouth. The dragon laughs at him because Grendel acts like a frightened rabbit in the dragon’s presence. The dragon notes that the terror he imposes on Grendel is comparable to the terror Grendel’s imposes over the humans. Through this analogy Grendel has a better understanding of the perspective of the Danes, and how it is so difficult for them to peacefully interact with Grendel. Grendel and the dragon then have an extensive conversation about humans, the reality of the universe, and a philosophical rant put in by John Gardner. Grendel has great difficulty understanding what the dragon means. One thing the dragon teaches is his idea of the human shapers. He believes that the shapers’ songs are all worthless illusions, meant to convert other peoples’ ideas into fictitious beliefs. He tells Grendel to discard any words sung by the shapers and ignore their messages. Another important idea emphasized by the dragon are the observations that Grendel makes based on only finite examples in small amounts of time. For example, Grendel only observes the cruel characteristics of a particular group of humans--the Danes. While it would be correct to say that “these humans act greedily”, Grendel may draw the incorrect conclusion “all humans have acted greedily forever”. The dragon uses the examples such as “one year is not concerned with thousands of years”, or “this is green” in contrast with “all those things are green”. A last important idea the dragon makes is that Grendel is a part of Hrothgar and his kingdom’s story. Grendel is to the humans as the mountain is to the climber whom ascends it. Even if Grendel were to leave the humans alone, they would be certain to sing and tell stories about some other obstacle they had to overcome. This obstacle would then become a part of the Danes’ identity just as Grendel had. --just my interpretations, I’m not a scholar -David
The dragon has the ability to see into the future, and the power to give really confusing advice and intel about the workings of the universe.
He gives Grendel a long lecture about the limits of the human mind. We make patterns and extend them beyond the knowledge that comes from observation, through the uneven playing field of imagination. We stretch, we theorize, we pull ideas from the deepest corners of our minds to make sense of the observable world. And yet, the observable world is nowhere near all there is. However, perceiving is believing, and so we find a way to downsize the abilities of the universe to fit with our conventional wisdom.
The dragon explains it best when he says, “The universe refuses the deadening influence of complete conformity. And yet in its refusal, it passes towards novel order as a primary requisite for important experience.” (67-68)
The world works in our favor in order for us to undergo this important experience, to live our limited human lives.
This is the first time Grendel is confronted with a power larger and stronger than he. This is the authors way of showing both sides of Grendel, his anger in the first chapter, and his fear in this one. Besides that, Grendel is taught about the ways of the Shaper, how he spins lies to seem like truth. Now from a human perspective, we know the so called "Shaper" is not spinning truth from lies, rather than using lies for entertainment which Grendel perceives in chapter three. This being said, it seems the author is contradicting himself. Moving on, Grendel is introduced to the idea of space and time. As Sir Moseley put it, Grendel becomes disinterested in these proceedings and is quickly reprimanded by the dragon. I believe the dragon alludes to the reason why Grendel is disinterested but the main point is that Grendel is an animal, rather, a predator. Thus, he loses interest in these philosophical ideas quickly because it is not his place to learn them. He may learn many things through experience and happenstance but he cannot be taught since one, he never has been, and two, his disposition doesn't allow it.
This chapter takes Grendel’s view and zooms out to show the bigger picture of him, the Shaper, and men in general. The dragon is given a personality completely opposite to that of Grendel’s mother, instead of being dulled and blunted to his surroundings, the dragon is almost omnipotent, able to see everything that was/is/will be. The dragon reveals the Shaper not as a creator of new truths, but a sort of connector of reality, someone who takes the wisps of knowledge owned by men and hazily connects them. This calms, if not extinguishes, Grendel’s fears. The dragon also states that he aspires only to sit upon his gold, a sort of inverse of Grendel’s beliefs. Grendel is stuck in his limited mind (compared to the dragon) and yet aspires to change the world and do things, while the dragon knows the full scope of things and yet doesn’t really want to interact with the world at all. This chapter is sort of about disproving the quote “Knowledge is power,” and more about “Ignorance is bliss.”
In chapter five of Grendel, Grendel meets the dragon. While meeting the dragon, Grendel experiences intense fear, to which the dragon responded, “now you know how they feel when they see you.” (Pg. 59) This gives Grendel an understanding of how the Danes feel and why he should not scare them for sport but just eat them every once in a while. The dragon also starts to laugh and points out the fact that Grendel looks like a scared rabbit when he is scared. He then goes on to tell Grendel that the shaper’s stories are merely illusions and deserve no response and no attention. He describes how the stories are facts glued together with lies. The dragon then goes on a rant about the reality of the universe and space and time. He also goes on to explain to Grendel that dragons cannot only see the past and present but also the future. Explaining that he does not however control the future even if he contributes to it. Many of these ideas Grendel finds incomprehensible. The dragon also seems to agree with Grendel that humans make useless patterns because they do not always understand what is going on around them. The dragon gets frustrated with Grendel saying that he only pays attention to excitement and violence. This chapter shows that the dragon is more philosophical then any man or Grendel and that he has seen the world as what it is, instead of creating patterns or perceiving it in a particularly way, as humans would.
When Grendel first sees the dragon face to face he gets frightened. The ironic thing is that he is treating the Dragon the way the people treat him. One of the first things that Grendel thinks is that he is lucky if he gets out of the dragons cave alive. Automatically assuming that the dragon is going to do something bad to him. He doesn’t realize what he is doing until the Dragon tells him that the same way he is acting when he looks at the dragon is the same way the humans feel towards Grendel. The reason why the dragon is Superior is because he is creepy looking and very wise.
Grendel visits a dragon that is described as large, red-golden who has a lot of gold and many treasures surrounding him. The dragon has already been expecting Grendel to come and he takes advantage of the horror and the discomfort that poor Grendel is in. In addition, the dragon says that, “his reaction to him is just like the human's’ reaction to Grendel”. The dragon tells him that he knows everything about everything. He sees the world as a worthless and chaotic place. The dragon tells Grendel about all of his different theories and believes. Grendel is able to get more out of what he actually came for, which was to seek for advise. In addition, we learn that the dragon knows what the future is, although it cannot be changed. For the people the shaper provides answers. Even though we know sometimes that it is not always true, it comforts them when they are unsure. Just like a god in religions, they make people feel safe and comfortable. The Shaper gives the people answers to the things they cannot figure out, it gives them something to believe and have hope for. Metztli Garcia
In this chapter, Grendel meets the dragon. At first, he is terrified by the appearance of the dragon, and the dragon starts laughing and points out that the way Grendel looks and acts in front of the dragon (Scared and rabbit-looking) is how the humans look at Grendel. He tells Grendel to not scare the human when he feels like it, but to go and "greet them" once in a while. Later on, the dragon talks about how they think differently in the mind compared to every other creature. They can see the future. He says that humans are ridiculous (Not directly) because they look for patterns when they cannot comprehend an object or situation. The dragon is superior due to him being very wise and different from other beings.
In the chapter Grendel meets with the dragon. The dragon is expecting him and frightens him. The dragon uses this as an opportunity to show Grendel how humans feel about him when they’re near him. The dragon tells Grendel he knows the future but is unable to change it and that is the difference between the shaper and him. The dragon has a better understanding as to why everyone wants answers to things even if they’re lies. The dragon tells Grendel about things he knows like space and time. He is full of knowledge and shares it with Grendel. Grendel tries to pay close attention to everything he’s saying to understand more. The dragon proves to be very philosophical and wise making him a reliable person for Grendel to go to. He advises Grendel to go seeking for gold, claiming it and keeping it. - Stephanie Medina
Dear Amy, Part 1 In this Chapter of Grendel, Grendel visits in the dragon either in his own dream, or he travels to the dragon's lair. Anyways, Grendel somehow manages to meet the dragon. At first, when Grendel sees the dragon, he is frightened by it. In which the dragon tells him now he know how other human feel when they see Grendel. Grendel who has traveled to meet the dragon is so afraid to even speak up, which causes the dragon to break into even more laughter, and commenting how Grendel looks like a rabbit. Dragon shows Grendel that Grendel is not the scariest monster by getting mad at Grendel for picking up his treasure and jewels. The dragon warns him to never never touch his jewels. Grendel who is too frightened to speak, annoys the dragon. The dragon who gets no answer from Grendel, doesn't need an answer simply because the dragon can simply read the mind of Grendel. The dragon who knows Grendel's question simply laughs, and gives Grendel advice to seek out gold and sit on it and guard the gold but of course not the dragon's gold. Grendel who was not satisfied with the advice, asks another question. And this time the dragon reads Grendel's mind and answers who is the Shaper. The dragon simply answers that the shaper makes an illusion in other people's mind. The dragon brings up the nature of humans and how he sees the humans differently. The dragon who can even see the future knows that the human's ignorance will destroy the universe. Seeing from the big bang to the apocalypse, knows that humans who will control the fate of the world, will destroy it with their stupid actions. Just like Grendel, the dragon thinks humans are stupid because they think know more than they actually do, like how humans make up things to fit in missing weaves and puzzles. According to the dragon, humans string up theories, only to interpret them. And those things humans make are all nonsense. The dragon gives an example of god, who is what the people had all made up to make themselves feel better. And there is always the Shaper, who duty is to manipulate the people into worshipping God. But, however, Grendel has no idea what the dragon is talking about. Sincerely, Your student, Dylan P.S. Part 2 coming out!
Dear Amy, Here is Part 2 So, Grendel is also kind of like the humans, who don't understand lots of things and tend to make up things, and believe in that nonsense. Instead the dragon believes in evolution, and that nothing will ever stay the same. The dragon's own philosophy is nihilism, which means life is meaningless, and nothing has value. In other words, he believes that life is just a random accident, and every changes, and nothing will stay forever. While Grendel who shares a different point of view from the dragon is existentialistic, which means there is no meaning in life, we are just here on Earth for no reason. However, the dragon who does not think Grendel's belief is right, predicts the apocalypse under the destruction of men. Grendel, who feels that he has no meaning, and unimportant, starts to feel bad. But the dragon who hates the humans, cheers Grendel up by telling him he has meaning, because the humans would not have created a scheme if they did not have fought Grendel. Which the dragon tells him Grendel has meaning in this world, because there will alway bee a need for an enemy. Grendel, who only wants to have someone to talk to, refuses the dragon's suggestion and leaves. But the dragon's last words are "What god? Where? Life-force, you mean? The principle of process? Or God as the history of chance?" Clearly this shows the dragon has no belief in a god. And before Grendel leaves, the dragon echoes to Grendel that he should follow the dragon's advice that is to seek out gold and sit on it. Therefore, the conversation between Grendel and the dragon is a complicated one not only to Grendel but to the readers, because the dragon explains his own opinions of the universe, and why we are here. And just like Grendel, since we are "related to him" feel bad because we have no meaning. In conclusion, I happened to be an atheist, and I believe that the dragon is right about the world, and there will always be a need for an enemy. So, therefore it is up to Grendel to be their enemy, so he can have some meaning in life. Sincerely, your student, Dylan P.S. That's it for now! See you in Chapter 6... hopefully!
In this chapter Grendel has an encounter with his Grendel. Like the humans, at first he is absoulutely horrified at just the sight of this monstrous beast (the dragon), and acts identical to the humans when they see him- perturbed and unsettled. After realizing that the dragon is merely a wise soul in a daunting body, Grendel feels shameful for his previous preposterous actions. Once Grendel regains his mental equilibrium, they begin to talk, and the dragon speaks about the world not as Grendel does (from the standpoint of a monster who suffers and complains constantly), but as a higher-power would, or even someone who can observe without letting their emotion prevail their thoughts. He speaks of the world as someone who knows the world like the back of their hand (or i guess in this case it would be a wing) would, and indeed he does. Unlike Grendel, the dragon can observe the world at all places at any time, and without the discourse that humans get-overriding emotion. The dragon spends his time atop his pile of gold, reviewing the world as if he were a food critíc, and has come to an understanding of how humans and Grendel view the world, as misguided as it is. He sees with his third-eye how humans string together thoughts and events like they are one beaded necklace of uncoordinated colors, and how they make use of completely unimportant things to sew together their false reality. This all flies right over Grendels head as he sits scratching his ass and looking up at the dragon explain the world as nobody else could. -julian
In this chapter Grendel has an encounter with his Grendel. Like the humans, at first he is absoulutely horrified at just the sight of this monstrous beast (the dragon), and acts identical to the humans when they see him- perturbed and unsettled. After realizing that the dragon is merely a wise soul in a daunting body, Grendel feels shameful for his previous preposterous actions. Once Grendel regains his mental equilibrium, they begin to talk, and the dragon speaks about the world not as Grendel does (from the standpoint of a monster who suffers and complains constantly), but as a higher-power would, or even someone who can observe without letting their emotion prevail their thoughts. He speaks of the world as someone who knows the world like the back of their hand (or i guess in this case it would be a wing) would, and indeed he does. Unlike Grendel, the dragon can observe the world at all places at any time, and without the discourse that humans get-overriding emotion. The dragon spends his time atop his pile of gold, reviewing the world as if he were a food critíc, and has come to an understanding of how humans and Grendel view the world, as misguided as it is. He sees with his third-eye how humans string together thoughts and events like they are one beaded necklace of uncoordinated colors, and how they make use of completely unimportant things to sew together their false reality. This all flies right over Grendels head as he sits scratching his ass and looking up at the dragon explain the world as nobody else could. -julian
Grendel has a spooky schizophrenic hallucination in which he is GIVEN, I emphasize this word because Grendel does not seem to be able to grasp a lot of the concepts he discovers. Anyway, throughout this chapter Grendel comes into contact with Nihilism, the belief that nothing matters because we're all going to die anyway, and existentialism, the belief that god is stooped, humans rock murrica for the win!...
In this chapter, Grendel meets the dragon. I prefer to think of the dragon as the actual dragon, and not just a figure of Grendel’s imagination. The dragon’s mind works differently than that of another creature in the way that it does not see time as linear and is somewhat omniscious. The dragon gives a weak attempt at explaining the universe to Grendel but can not explain it due to the lack of scientific understanding that Grendel has. Grendel is angered by this and does not understand much if not anything that the dragon tells him. This may have lead Grendel to become angry and confused at the universe for his current state.
In chapter 5, Grendel meets the dragon. it is unclear weather he actually experiences the dragon in the flesh, or encounters him in the dream world. Grendel is scared out of his mind and for the first time feels how the humans feel when they see him. The dragon goes into a very long philosophical tirade on the limits of the brain and how we humans can make a pattern out of almost anything. Grendel (like me) is very confused and disoriented. The dragon's mind works much differently than human minds, unlike us, the dragon can see past, present, and future. Thus, the dragon knows how, when, where, and who will kill both him and Grendel. As you probably can see, this whole omniscient thing leads as a big factor in confusing Grendel during their conversation.
Grendel meets the dragon and he is really confused about how he feels about not being the same about humans being different. The dragon goes on a big rant about everything happening in the city. ~ Oswald
Throughout history, stories have been told of great heroes who have triumphed, but these brave souls rarely do not have help achieving their greatness. Heroes always need help, they must learn how to defeat the darkness, and they must learn from the best, they need a mentor to succeed. Usually it is an old wise man, or in Grendel’s case, an old wise dragon. Greedy about his gold, Grendel encounters an old dragon with amazing theories that I can barely understand and an odd sense of humor. Only wanting a simply wanting an answer, Grendel receives a lot more than what he bargained for. The dragon instead of giving Grendel a straight answer begins on discussing, or more accurately talking at Grendel, about his abilities and his different theories of the universe. Trying to follow along, Grendel is told that dragons could see the future. They perceive it just like how we perceive the past and present. “…We see from the mountaintop: all time, all space…” Dragons can only see the future but they cannot change it. Even if one was to act on a random impulse, they still do what they originally saw. We humans and Grendel can only “think what we think”. We operate in “tunnel vision” where we do not perceive or understand everything that is happening around us. For us, sharpers are our “saviors”, they provide us an illusion, they mend our “useless” facts together, and create a connection, which is what we as a species spend our whole life doing; creating connections that are simply not there. Grendel defines us. By making us think, create, and confront him it helps us “create us”. By interacting with Grendel he drives us to learn what we are, we make up stories of where he comes from, what he is made of, and why he is here. While we are creating the mystery of Grendel, we are solving the mystery of who we are. This and the dragon’s other multitude of theories are truly fascinating. While the dragon is discretely answering Grendel’s questions, he is also providing Grendel and the readers with an amazing question of who are we? And, what is our purpose?
ReplyDelete~Shelby
5. This Chapter really opened my eyes in terms of Grendel’s education about the world. It seems to me that Grendel has his own mentor, a wise dragon who has been around long enough to help Grendel understand the difference between the truth, and a twisted tail told by the likes of the Shaper. Grendel seems to also have a form ADHD. What I mean by this is when the dragon begins to talk about the forms of chaos men can cause he begins to become uninterested. The dragon says he only is interested in the hunt and killing. That’s understandable because that’s all he has been around his entire life, and he’s had to fight to survive in this world dominated by man. Grendel also learns a lesson he had never understood before. When he saw the dragon, he became over powered by fear and all he could do was stare. With the unexpected help of the dragon, Grendel realized the true terror of coming face to face with a force no one understands. Hopefully, this encounter has opened his eyes to why he is feared throughout the land.
ReplyDelete~Ben Moseley
Chapter five recounts Grendel’s encounter with the mighty dragon. The dragon greets Grendel as if he were an expected guest, claiming to possess complete knowledge of the universe’s past, future, and present. Upon meeting the dragon Grendel feels the sensation of fear for one of first times in his life. The dragon is not only much larger than Grendel, with great tusks and claws, but also spews hot fire from his mouth. The dragon laughs at him because Grendel acts like a frightened rabbit in the dragon’s presence. The dragon notes that the terror he imposes on Grendel is comparable to the terror Grendel’s imposes over the humans. Through this analogy Grendel has a better understanding of the perspective of the Danes, and how it is so difficult for them to peacefully interact with Grendel. Grendel and the dragon then have an extensive conversation about humans, the reality of the universe, and a philosophical rant put in by John Gardner. Grendel has great difficulty understanding what the dragon means. One thing the dragon teaches is his idea of the human shapers. He believes that the shapers’ songs are all worthless illusions, meant to convert other peoples’ ideas into fictitious beliefs. He tells Grendel to discard any words sung by the shapers and ignore their messages. Another important idea emphasized by the dragon are the observations that Grendel makes based on only finite examples in small amounts of time. For example, Grendel only observes the cruel characteristics of a particular group of humans--the Danes. While it would be correct to say that “these humans act greedily”, Grendel may draw the incorrect conclusion “all humans have acted greedily forever”. The dragon uses the examples such as “one year is not concerned with thousands of years”, or “this is green” in contrast with “all those things are green”. A last important idea the dragon makes is that Grendel is a part of Hrothgar and his kingdom’s story. Grendel is to the humans as the mountain is to the climber whom ascends it. Even if Grendel were to leave the humans alone, they would be certain to sing and tell stories about some other obstacle they had to overcome. This obstacle would then become a part of the Danes’ identity just as Grendel had.
ReplyDelete--just my interpretations, I’m not a scholar -David
The dragon has the ability to see into the future, and the power to give really confusing advice and intel about the workings of the universe.
ReplyDeleteHe gives Grendel a long lecture about the limits of the human mind. We make patterns and extend them beyond the knowledge that comes from observation, through the uneven playing field of imagination. We stretch, we theorize, we pull ideas from the deepest corners of our minds to make sense of the observable world. And yet, the observable world is nowhere near all there is. However, perceiving is believing, and so we find a way to downsize the abilities of the universe to fit with our conventional wisdom.
The dragon explains it best when he says, “The universe refuses the deadening influence of complete conformity. And yet in its refusal, it passes towards novel order as a primary requisite for important experience.” (67-68)
The world works in our favor in order for us to undergo this important experience, to live our limited human lives.
—Haven
This is the first time Grendel is confronted with a power larger and stronger than he. This is the authors way of showing both sides of Grendel, his anger in the first chapter, and his fear in this one. Besides that, Grendel is taught about the ways of the Shaper, how he spins lies to seem like truth. Now from a human perspective, we know the so called "Shaper" is not spinning truth from lies, rather than using lies for entertainment which Grendel perceives in chapter three. This being said, it seems the author is contradicting himself. Moving on, Grendel is introduced to the idea of space and time. As Sir Moseley put it, Grendel becomes disinterested in these proceedings and is quickly reprimanded by the dragon. I believe the dragon alludes to the reason why Grendel is disinterested but the main point is that Grendel is an animal, rather, a predator. Thus, he loses interest in these philosophical ideas quickly because it is not his place to learn them. He may learn many things through experience and happenstance but he cannot be taught since one, he never has been, and two, his disposition doesn't allow it.
ReplyDelete-Cameron
DeleteThis chapter takes Grendel’s view and zooms out to show the bigger picture of him, the Shaper, and men in general. The dragon is given a personality completely opposite to that of Grendel’s mother, instead of being dulled and blunted to his surroundings, the dragon is almost omnipotent, able to see everything that was/is/will be. The dragon reveals the Shaper not as a creator of new truths, but a sort of connector of reality, someone who takes the wisps of knowledge owned by men and hazily connects them. This calms, if not extinguishes, Grendel’s fears. The dragon also states that he aspires only to sit upon his gold, a sort of inverse of Grendel’s beliefs. Grendel is stuck in his limited mind (compared to the dragon) and yet aspires to change the world and do things, while the dragon knows the full scope of things and yet doesn’t really want to interact with the world at all. This chapter is sort of about disproving the quote “Knowledge is power,” and more about “Ignorance is bliss.”
ReplyDelete-George
In chapter five of Grendel, Grendel meets the dragon. While meeting the dragon, Grendel experiences intense fear, to which the dragon responded, “now you know how they feel when they see you.” (Pg. 59) This gives Grendel an understanding of how the Danes feel and why he should not scare them for sport but just eat them every once in a while. The dragon also starts to laugh and points out the fact that Grendel looks like a scared rabbit when he is scared. He then goes on to tell Grendel that the shaper’s stories are merely illusions and deserve no response and no attention. He describes how the stories are facts glued together with lies. The dragon then goes on a rant about the reality of the universe and space and time. He also goes on to explain to Grendel that dragons cannot only see the past and present but also the future. Explaining that he does not however control the future even if he contributes to it. Many of these ideas Grendel finds incomprehensible. The dragon also seems to agree with Grendel that humans make useless patterns because they do not always understand what is going on around them. The dragon gets frustrated with Grendel saying that he only pays attention to excitement and violence. This chapter shows that the dragon is more philosophical then any man or Grendel and that he has seen the world as what it is, instead of creating patterns or perceiving it in a particularly way, as humans would.
ReplyDelete-Isabella
When Grendel first sees the dragon face to face he gets frightened. The ironic thing is that he is treating the Dragon the way the people treat him. One of the first things that Grendel thinks is that he is lucky if he gets out of the dragons cave alive. Automatically assuming that the dragon is going to do something bad to him. He doesn’t realize what he is doing until the Dragon tells him that the same way he is acting when he looks at the dragon is the same way the humans feel towards Grendel. The reason why the dragon is Superior is because he is creepy looking and very wise.
ReplyDeleteGrendel visits a dragon that is described as large, red-golden who has a lot of gold and many treasures surrounding him. The dragon has already been expecting Grendel to come and he takes advantage of the horror and the discomfort that poor Grendel is in. In addition, the dragon says that, “his reaction to him is just like the human's’ reaction to Grendel”. The dragon tells him that he knows everything about everything. He sees the world as a worthless and chaotic place. The dragon tells Grendel about all of his different theories and believes. Grendel is able to get more out of what he actually came for, which was to seek for advise. In addition, we learn that the dragon knows what the future is, although it cannot be changed. For the people the shaper provides answers. Even though we know sometimes that it is not always true, it comforts them when they are unsure. Just like a god in religions, they make people feel safe and comfortable. The Shaper gives the people answers to the things they cannot figure out, it gives them something to believe and have hope for.
ReplyDeleteMetztli Garcia
In this chapter, Grendel meets the dragon. At first, he is terrified by the appearance of the dragon, and the dragon starts laughing and points out that the way Grendel looks and acts in front of the dragon (Scared and rabbit-looking) is how the humans look at Grendel. He tells Grendel to not scare the human when he feels like it, but to go and "greet them" once in a while. Later on, the dragon talks about how they think differently in the mind compared to every other creature. They can see the future. He says that humans are ridiculous (Not directly) because they look for patterns when they cannot comprehend an object or situation. The dragon is superior due to him being very wise and different from other beings.
ReplyDeleteIn the chapter Grendel meets with the dragon. The dragon is expecting him and frightens him. The dragon uses this as an opportunity to show Grendel how humans feel about him when they’re near him. The dragon tells Grendel he knows the future but is unable to change it and that is the difference between the shaper and him. The dragon has a better understanding as to why everyone wants answers to things even if they’re lies. The dragon tells Grendel about things he knows like space and time. He is full of knowledge and shares it with Grendel. Grendel tries to pay close attention to everything he’s saying to understand more. The dragon proves to be very philosophical and wise making him a reliable person for Grendel to go to. He advises Grendel to go seeking for gold, claiming it and keeping it.
ReplyDelete- Stephanie Medina
Dear Amy,
ReplyDeletePart 1
In this Chapter of Grendel, Grendel visits in the dragon either in his own dream, or he travels to the dragon's lair. Anyways, Grendel somehow manages to meet the dragon. At first, when Grendel sees the dragon, he is frightened by it. In which the dragon tells him now he know how other human feel when they see Grendel. Grendel who has traveled to meet the dragon is so afraid to even speak up, which causes the dragon to break into even more laughter, and commenting how Grendel looks like a rabbit. Dragon shows Grendel that Grendel is not the scariest monster by getting mad at Grendel for picking up his treasure and jewels. The dragon warns him to never never touch his jewels. Grendel who is too frightened to speak, annoys the dragon. The dragon who gets no answer from Grendel, doesn't need an answer simply because the dragon can simply read the mind of Grendel. The dragon who knows Grendel's question simply laughs, and gives Grendel advice to seek out gold and sit on it and guard the gold but of course not the dragon's gold. Grendel who was not satisfied with the advice, asks another question. And this time the dragon reads Grendel's mind and answers who is the Shaper. The dragon simply answers that the shaper makes an illusion in other people's mind. The dragon brings up the nature of humans and how he sees the humans differently. The dragon who can even see the future knows that the human's ignorance will destroy the universe. Seeing from the big bang to the apocalypse, knows that humans who will control the fate of the world, will destroy it with their stupid actions. Just like Grendel, the dragon thinks humans are stupid because they think know more than they actually do, like how humans make up things to fit in missing weaves and puzzles. According to the dragon, humans string up theories, only to interpret them. And those things humans make are all nonsense. The dragon gives an example of god, who is what the people had all made up to make themselves feel better. And there is always the Shaper, who duty is to manipulate the people into worshipping God. But, however, Grendel has no idea what the dragon is talking about.
Sincerely,
Your student,
Dylan
P.S. Part 2 coming out!
Dear Amy,
ReplyDeleteHere is Part 2
So, Grendel is also kind of like the humans, who don't understand lots of things and tend to make up things, and believe in that nonsense. Instead the dragon believes in evolution, and that nothing will ever stay the same. The dragon's own philosophy is nihilism, which means life is meaningless, and nothing has value. In other words, he believes that life is just a random accident, and every changes, and nothing will stay forever. While Grendel who shares a different point of view from the dragon is existentialistic, which means there is no meaning in life, we are just here on Earth for no reason. However, the dragon who does not think Grendel's belief is right, predicts the apocalypse under the destruction of men. Grendel, who feels that he has no meaning, and unimportant, starts to feel bad. But the dragon who hates the humans, cheers Grendel up by telling him he has meaning, because the humans would not have created a scheme if they did not have fought Grendel. Which the dragon tells him Grendel has meaning in this world, because there will alway bee a need for an enemy. Grendel, who only wants to have someone to talk to, refuses the dragon's suggestion and leaves. But the dragon's last words are "What god? Where? Life-force, you mean? The principle of process? Or God as the history of chance?" Clearly this shows the dragon has no belief in a god. And before Grendel leaves, the dragon echoes to Grendel that he should follow the dragon's advice that is to seek out gold and sit on it. Therefore, the conversation between Grendel and the dragon is a complicated one not only to Grendel but to the readers, because the dragon explains his own opinions of the universe, and why we are here. And just like Grendel, since we are "related to him" feel bad because we have no meaning. In conclusion, I happened to be an atheist, and I believe that the dragon is right about the world, and there will always be a need for an enemy. So, therefore it is up to Grendel to be their enemy, so he can have some meaning in life.
Sincerely,
your student,
Dylan
P.S. That's it for now! See you in Chapter 6... hopefully!
In this chapter Grendel has an encounter with his Grendel. Like the humans, at first he is absoulutely horrified at just the sight of this monstrous beast (the dragon), and acts identical to the humans when they see him- perturbed and unsettled. After realizing that the dragon is merely a wise soul in a daunting body, Grendel feels shameful for his previous preposterous actions. Once Grendel regains his mental equilibrium, they begin to talk, and the dragon speaks about the world not as Grendel does (from the standpoint of a monster who suffers and complains constantly), but as a higher-power would, or even someone who can observe without letting their emotion prevail their thoughts. He speaks of the world as someone who knows the world like the back of their hand (or i guess in this case it would be a wing) would, and indeed he does. Unlike Grendel, the dragon can observe the world at all places at any time, and without the discourse that humans get-overriding emotion. The dragon spends his time atop his pile of gold, reviewing the world as if he were a food critíc, and has come to an understanding of how humans and Grendel view the world, as misguided as it is. He sees with his third-eye how humans string together thoughts and events like they are one beaded necklace of uncoordinated colors, and how they make use of completely unimportant things to sew together their false reality. This all flies right over Grendels head as he sits scratching his ass and looking up at the dragon explain the world as nobody else could.
ReplyDelete-julian
In this chapter Grendel has an encounter with his Grendel. Like the humans, at first he is absoulutely horrified at just the sight of this monstrous beast (the dragon), and acts identical to the humans when they see him- perturbed and unsettled. After realizing that the dragon is merely a wise soul in a daunting body, Grendel feels shameful for his previous preposterous actions. Once Grendel regains his mental equilibrium, they begin to talk, and the dragon speaks about the world not as Grendel does (from the standpoint of a monster who suffers and complains constantly), but as a higher-power would, or even someone who can observe without letting their emotion prevail their thoughts. He speaks of the world as someone who knows the world like the back of their hand (or i guess in this case it would be a wing) would, and indeed he does. Unlike Grendel, the dragon can observe the world at all places at any time, and without the discourse that humans get-overriding emotion. The dragon spends his time atop his pile of gold, reviewing the world as if he were a food critíc, and has come to an understanding of how humans and Grendel view the world, as misguided as it is. He sees with his third-eye how humans string together thoughts and events like they are one beaded necklace of uncoordinated colors, and how they make use of completely unimportant things to sew together their false reality. This all flies right over Grendels head as he sits scratching his ass and looking up at the dragon explain the world as nobody else could.
ReplyDelete-julian
Grendel has a spooky schizophrenic hallucination in which he is GIVEN, I emphasize this word because Grendel does not seem to be able to grasp a lot of the concepts he discovers. Anyway, throughout this chapter Grendel comes into contact with Nihilism, the belief that nothing matters because we're all going to die anyway, and existentialism, the belief that god is stooped, humans rock murrica for the win!...
ReplyDelete-that one riefe brother that you have for C block
In this chapter, Grendel meets the dragon. I prefer to think of the dragon as the actual dragon, and not just a figure of Grendel’s imagination. The dragon’s mind works differently than that of another creature in the way that it does not see time as linear and is somewhat omniscious. The dragon gives a weak attempt at explaining the universe to Grendel but can not explain it due to the lack of scientific understanding that Grendel has. Grendel is angered by this and does not understand much if not anything that the dragon tells him. This may have lead Grendel to become angry and confused at the universe for his current state.
ReplyDeleteAdam
In chapter 5, Grendel meets the dragon. it is unclear weather he actually experiences the dragon in the flesh, or encounters him in the dream world. Grendel is scared out of his mind and for the first time feels how the humans feel when they see him. The dragon goes into a very long philosophical tirade on the limits of the brain and how we humans can make a pattern out of almost anything. Grendel (like me) is very confused and disoriented. The dragon's mind works much differently than human minds, unlike us, the dragon can see past, present, and future. Thus, the dragon knows how, when, where, and who will kill both him and Grendel. As you probably can see, this whole omniscient thing leads as a big factor in confusing Grendel during their conversation.
ReplyDeleteGrendel meets the dragon and he is really confused about how he feels about not being the same about humans being different. The dragon goes on a big rant about everything happening in the city.
ReplyDelete~ Oswald