This is the first chapter that is not mostly focused on Grendel. It is mostly about the character Hrothulf, who doesn’t appear in the original tale. Hrothulf is a quiet, intelligent, and dangerous character. As the chapter progresses, we learn about him and the silent threat he poses to Hrothgar. Hrothulf is Hrothgar’s nephew, and so Hrothgar is bound to take him in regardless of him already having male heirs. Hrothulf is accompanied by his counselor, Red Horse. Red Horse is proof of the dragon’s point that humans spend too much time worrying about their little ideas and ideals, as the entirety of his conversation is spent musing on government. What I find interesting are the comparisons between Hrothulf and Grendel. They are both quiet, but they are also completely opposite in another regard. Hrothulf is secretly dangerous, and Grendel is outwardly dangerous but inwardly smart.
Two points from Red Horse’s speech I find connect with Grendel.
First, Red Horse says that all one must do is remove the morals and values from a man, and thus, he is corrupted. The same happened with Grendel when he had his first encounter with humans, coming to the realization that they will never be on the same side. He loses the value of friendship, and switches into lone attacker mode. His “human” values are gone, and he has been changed forever. He has switched to the dark side.
Second, Red Horse states that the star citizens of a kingdom are treated well for their perfect fit into the society. Those who cannot conform are driven into “the darkest corners of the kingdom.” Grendel does not fit in among the humans, and thus, he is pushed into the darkest corners of his mind.
8. This chapter takes a different turn in the form of describing the current kingdom. There is a character that is brought up in this chapter known as Hrothulf. He hasn’t been shown in the original Beowulf story, but he is shown as the nephew of Hrothgar the current king. This character is shown as a wimpy child who isn’t even old enough to have hair on his lip. He’s shy and quiet, but inside he is a large threat to the kingdom. Since he is family, Hrothgar would be more than happy to take him in, it could spell trouble for the other people in line to receive the throne when Hrothgar is to old to run the kingdom, and with that it could change they why society is run in this place, and it could take a turn for the worst. Hrothgar is an old and simple man and he knows that governments are monstrously evil wen put into the wrong hands. This could happen if he turns the kingdom over to Hrothulf. I also see similarities between Grendel and Hrothulf. Grendel and he are opposites, but harbor similar qualities. Grendel is a force to be reckoned with due to his physical prowess and evil nature displayed to all, but on the inside he’s not a total beast with still some regard to human life. Hrothulf is a wimp who’s scrawny and young and probably couldn’t take on anyone in a fight. He is quite and soft spoken on the outside, but on the inside he’s a landmine ready to explode, due to his dislike of Hrothgar’s way to rule a kingdom. Grendel and Hrothulf are like two sides of the same coin. Regardless how you flip this coin, you will always get some form of evil, but will it be in the form of a beast? Or of a man? ~Ben Moseley
“Politics is a dirty business.” We all have heard this phrase or seen it somewhere in our lives, well, for Red Horse quite literally being a dirty hobo he speaks the ruthless truth about politics. Red Horse seems to be the typical crazy old man, but he is in fact quite the opposite. This homeless man is quite wise and understands a lot more about the how the government works than the Average Joe. Governments claim that what they do is for the common good, but in reality the government is used to keep those in power or of a high status in power and keep everyone else at a lower level. He also stated that “…those who have the power of the state stands above the society, regulating it…keeping it in the bounds of order…” or bounds of the “norm”. But those who try to retaliate or do not conform to our ideas of order are cast out, arrested, or executed. This could be exactly linked to our monster Grendel. We have been taught since a young age that monsters are bad, dangers; they do not comply with our idea of normal or order. In fact monsters, like Grendel, are exactly the opposite their physical appearance is abnormal and usually if one encounters a dangerous demon the resulting action would generally not be considered order; Grendel breaking and trashing the mead hall. But why do we find these monsters to be so bad? If we were taught that monsters were in fact good, then Grendel could have possibly taken a different road in life, he does always beg for mercy and forgiveness. It would be easy to give a human, something we consider normal, forgiveness, but since we perceive monsters as bad creatures we would never forgive them. Monsters are not normal, they could be, but we do not give them the chance. Why is that? It is because the government teaches us, essentially, that these beings are bad and we will always see them as bad, because we are hardwired to. Since theses monsters are not normal we do not feel that they belong with us. We reward those “who fit the System best… but those who don’t fit…are driven to the darkest corners of the kingdom…” Since Grendel does not fit the government’s ideal of normal, he does not fit in at all. So we drive him and the other demons to the farthest part of the kingdom. The government is a monster, worst than Grendel, deciding who and who does not fit our “bill” of order. I guess the government, Hrothgar, and Grendel aren’t so different after all.
Chapter 8 has more a political side then any other chapter we have read. In this chapter we are introduced to Red Horse and Hothulf. Red horse talks about how the government is evil. He says that if there were to be a revolution it would be the way the system is because it’s not fair. He didn’t understand how a thief stealing bread would die versus a person how killed someone would not be punished. This mad him furious it didn’t make sense. He states that violence is the way they are ruled but it’s not effective in his opinion
In this chapter, a new character is introduce. His name is Hrothulf, Hrothgar's niece. Hrothulf meets an old man in a forest that goes by the nickname Red Dragon. Red Dragon tells Hrothulf about how the government is corrupted and lies, since they need the people in the state in order to keep their power. Hrothulf and the old man are like Grendel and the dragon. The old man states that people or too conscious on the little things and Hrothulf relates to Grendel since they are both dangerous, but intelligent. On the other hand, Hrothgar's kingdom is in a tiny crisis right now because everyone fears him for his cowardliness, when he did not choose to help Wealtheow while Grendel was attacking.
In this chapter, we meet Hrothulf, Grendel’s nephew and the Red Dragon. The Red Dragon seems like a crazy old man, but really he know the truth about politics and government, explaining how evil they are and about how they lie, saying they do things for the good of all but really they only benefit those in power. Hrothulf agrees with the onl man and can also see the evil of government and power. This worries Hrothgar, however he cannot get rid of his dead brothers son. The red dragon is similar to the dragon because he sees the truth of everything and that everything is corrupt. Hrothulf can compare to Grendel because like Grendel he sees the evil in power but is shy yet dangerous. Hrothgar also fears of both Grendel and Hrothulf attacking.
Hrothulf has appeared with his extremely unique ideas at Hart and after his father was killed, Hrothgar and Wealtheow take him in as one of their own. Hrothulf changed the community of the Scyldings because of the new forms of political knowledge he brought, his goal was to change the inequality of power. “Freedom for the winners and enslavement of the rest” was a statement said by the old man, which Hrothulf extremely disagrees with. Instead, he believes that both the working class and ruling class are alike. He thinks that the Scyldings are built off of violence and still have not changed. This has to do with Grendel because Hrothulf, just like Grendel, is alone and annoyed with the world they live in. Both of them are searching for reasons with evidence that will explain the problems with the world. In addition, Hrothulf and Red Horse are similar to the relationship between Grendel and the dragon. Both of their mentors seem to always be a step ahead of them and enjoy mocking them. Metztli Garcia
Chapter 8 introduces us to Hrothulf, Hrothgar’s nephew, and Red Horse. Red Horse is an old man who doesn’t seems crazy but in reality knows a lot. He speaks about the truth of politics and how the government works. He describes it as very evil and explains to Grendel how corrupt things are and some of the lies that are thrown around. Red Horse has a lot of knowledge on things but that doesn’t mean he has control over them. Just like Grendel Hrothulf knows more than everyone thinks he does and is trying to find explanations as to why things are the way they are. Neither of them enjoy the conditions and circumstances they are put through. Also, they each have a someone who knows more than they do and feeds them with information. Stephanie Medina
Obviously, Grendel is far more poetic in this chapter than in any of the previous ones. We see that he writes scenes as if they are for movies, and the structure and wording of many paragraphs are written to be poetry. Again, Grendel is crazy. He keeps teeter-tottering between nihilism and emotion-driven actions. Although Grendel is very poetic in the beginning of chapter 8, he goes back to his normal descriptions of his depressing life. After he stopped being poetic, Grendel introduced Hrothulf (Hrothgar's nephew), and his old peasant of a friend, Red Horse. At first, Red Horse comes off as a socialist while speaking to Hrothulf, but he instead began commenting on the evil nature of all governments. As an anarchist, I don't see how he spends his time at the side of one of the King's family members. Why is he so close to the evil government? Sebastian
Grendel has been moved. Not only does the create a story (if he does so in the first place) but he appears to be expressing sympathy for one that broke his definition of human. Grendel is insane, as I have mentioned before, and thus writes these scenes perhaps to try out what Shaper really did. Shaper mixed past and present in what seemed like truth and, this is why the chapter is quite interesting, creating confusion. Is this the truth? It does seem like it with the brief history before the actual story but even if the characters were real, did this scene take place? Did the characters act as portrayed? Grendel has dabbled in storytelling and come up with something from his imagination based off of past or complete fabrication. Later in the story, Red Horse, a peasant, speaks to Hrothulf of government and, somewhat not surprisingly, despises all forms of government. As Grendel does not know of government and simply sees it as a human construct which they are quite obsessed with, he finds all of them evil, thus sticking to his role.
The stogie introduces us to Red Horse and Hrothulf. Hrothulf is the ambitious nephew of Hrothgar and Red Horse is an anarchist who believes all governments are evil. Red Horse is trying to explain to Hrothulf how states are evil. -Evan
In this chapter, Grendel’s poetic side shows up more than in another chapter. He starts off with pages of very detailed and movie like, epic scenes which helps people from the time of similar movies and television, which truly helps modern readers to relate. As usual, Grendel is stalking Hrothgar and his people and becomes very confused angry and baffled by the politics that are brought up by Hrothgar’s nephew and a peasant. Hrothulf believes are very altered by the conversation with red horse. Red horse comes off as a socialist but brings up the idea that even the principle of a government is evil and punishing. This goes against all that Hrothulf knows and believes and is outraged by the end of the conversation.
In chapter eight of “Grendel”, Grendel watches the development of Hrothgar’s nephew, Hrothulf. Hrothulf is a quiet and aloof person, not very interactive with his peers or adult acquaintances, and has lost his father. He is also not as easily tricked by the songs of shapers, and constantly seeks to answer questions about the world and stretches to find the truth behind social constructs of his nation. These characteristics are related to Grendel’s in many ways. Grendel is also not very interactive with other creatures or human beings, and has no father apparent in his life. Both Grendel and Hrothulf seek knowledge and answers to the questions they ponder in their spare time. When Hrothulf is lectured by the blind peasant “Red Horse”, he becomes certain in viewpoint that Hrothgar’s government system is corrupt. Similar to Grendel he is not persuaded by the shapers to believe in Hrothgar’s greatness, or of the nobility of Hrothgar’s heroic thanes. Instead he and Red Horse believe that the Hrothgar’s institution, which holds a monopoly on the violence, army, and police work of the nation, uses that power to keep those at the top of the hierarchy in a position of legitimacy for whatever actions they choose to make. They use this power to push those who are not welcome in the upper class into a state of oppression. Peasants at the bottom who happen call out for justice or civil liberty are easily imprisoned or executed because the state holds this monopoly over “legitimate violence”. Red horse and Hrothulf differ in opinion of the state of “all” government systems being corrupt. Hrothulf agrees that Hrothgar’s system is corrupt, but he believes under his own rule the nation could become prosperous and equal for all people. Since Hrothulf would become the new heir to the king once his cousins, Hrothgar’s sons, die, he plans to frame the accidental death of Hrothgar’s sons so that he could become king after Hrothgar. He would then establish his envisioned liberal and cooperative nation. While Grendel does not have plans to become king over Heorot, it is possible that he would kill Grendel’s sons to disprove the shaper’s ideas of a strong kingdom. Additionally, it is possible that Grendel may be against Hrothulf’s plans to overthrow Hrothgar because Grendel would then lose his identity as Hrothgar’s bane. We know that Hrothulf does not live through the story of Beowulf, and that Hrothgar has to rule over his nation for many years past the defeat of Grendel, so something must arise that stops Hrothulf from succeeding in his plans. -David
Red horse and Hrothgar's nephew Hrothulf in this chapter are the most important political figure that we have seen yet. The political concepts, anarchy and Revolution are important in this chapter because all kingdoms are mostly ruled by violence which is not an effective strategy that the continue to participate in.
How does this affect Grendel? Well depending on two options Hrothulf has, Grendel will either go home with less meat (by eating hrothulf) or go home with more meat (hrothgar is fat right?) The book has stated a few many times that Grendel is what defines the people in heorot, therefore what he does to either hrothulf or hrothgar or any of the royal family will affect what happens to the kingdom, this gives Grendel a definition, finally his life can move on......oh.....actually, Grendel is to stupid to realize his life is what he makes it, that old dragon put it into his head that the world would end anyway and it didn't matter what he did so now Grendel clings to that, and any sort of philosophic notion like a star wars nerd clinging to a lightsaber. In short, Grendel is not affected by this really as he has no ties to the kingdom, the only thing it would give him is time to ponder, but nooo, Grendel wouldn't do that since he's so set on not caring at all.
Dear Amy, In Chapter 8, Grendel starts to act like the shaper in his poetic narrations. Grendel begins his narrations by acting out and breaking apart the book into small scenes. It all starts when Halga the Good, younger brother of Hrothgar dies. Halga's son, Hrothulf, the nephew of Hrothgar, at 14 years old, is already a pretender to Hrothgar's throne, and kingdom. Hrothulf is described by Grendel as a small scorpion. A scorpion is a small, stealthy, and has a poisonous bite. Hrothulf is the scorpion and he is more dangerous than he looks. Grendel sees the low class praying to the king, saying "long live the king", "To whom we owe all joy"! Grendel scoffs at this by asking himself why does the bread thief die and the murdering thanes get to escape? Why does the murderer get to escape and live, when the bread thief was killed by the government (executed), since he stole bread because he was hungry. This is the first sign of corruption in government according to Grendel. Gremdel compares the government as a tree. And a tree is a tyrant because it casts a shadow o the ground, and outcompetes the other plants. Another time, Grendel observes from Queen Wealtheow that she is worried that Hrothulf and her babes will fight over the kingdom because of blood rights. Grenades sees that Wealtheow is worried that Hrothgar will not be close to his children, and he will give the throne to Hrothulf. In conclusion, Hrothulf and Grendel are both lonely and want to be important, want to have a purpose, a meaning in life, and a reason to live for. Sincerely, Dylan
Part 2 Meanwhile, Hrothuf who wants to become the king of Hrothgar's kingdom, seeks Red Horse, an old man for help on how he can gat to be king/ Red Horse tells him he has to believe in violence, in order to succeed. And in a revolution, you need to believe in violence. Because Red Horse tells him, if we have a revolution, we will realize what our actions had done. Red Horse gives an example to Hrothulf,about religion which tears something apart and creates in its replacement something new. John Grendel alludes this to people murdering each other over religion. As Red Horse, says violence is the answer if Hrothulf wants to become king, because it will get him to where he wants to be. Red Horse explains to Hrothulf that a kingdom protects the power of the government and prevents people from revolting. The government's power is to be keep people in content and from rising to the government. Red Horse explains to him that revolution is just violence, winners win, and losers get enslaved. A State is all about violence. Red Horse believes all government are evil. Hrothulf wants to make things even between people. And that violence is not the answer only violence should be allowed for the people's own good. ("the ends justify the means"). While Red Horse says only violence can change a government. While Grendel watching this feels pleasure, and enjoys the violence grow in Hrothulf. However, Hrothulf who wants to be king, still is nice to Hrothgar's children. Hrothulf is described to be a moody, lonely you man, afraid of strangers, and awkward with the adults he knew well. While Hrothgar is getting older, Wealtheow worries of Hrothulf becoming king instead of her children, realizing that Hrothulf and Hygmond all want to be king. However Grendel notes that Hrothgar will always be his target even though he is getting older and weaker by day. After all, Grendel is satisfied that he has won the battle against Hrothgar. Grendel proves he is a coward after trying to take away Wealtheow, while Hrothgar sits there without helping his wife. Grendel also finds himself to be satisfied because he is the condition in which they thrive. Grendel had created the humans, he says, after all what were the humans be without him? Would Hrothgar be the king he is without Grendel? In the end of the chapter, Grendel dreams that he and Hrothgar are represented as two trees. Grendel and Hrothgar are like the two trees entwined, they need each other to survive. Grendel needs Hrothgar to have purpose in life. While Hrothgar needs Grendel to be the man the Shaper tells tales, cites poems, and sings songs about. Therefore Hrothgar wouldn't haven an illusiion as a brave king he is without Grendel, and Grendel will not me the monster, the wrecker of medals without Hrothgar as his target. In conclusion, they all need each other, and both Grendel and Hrothgar are essential to each of his owns purpose. Sincerely, Dylan
When Hrothgar’s brother, Halga, is murdered, Halga’s fourteen-year-old son, Hrothulf, comes to live at Hart. By this time, Hrothgar and Wealtheow have two sons of their own. Hrothulf, though polite, is sullen and withdrawn. Hrothgar tries to attribute the boy’s malaise to the trauma of losing his father, but he also suspects that the boy may be plotting against him. Grendel confirms this when he spies on Hrothulf and Red Horse in the forest.
At this time, Hrothgar, who has just begun raising two kids with his new wife, Wealtheow, takes in his fourteen-year-old nephew, Hrothulf, who comes off as mannerly and civil, but may have sinister plans. While Grendel is observing Hrothulf, he notices some of the qualities present in Hrothulf's behaviors reflect qualities in his behaviors. Hrothgar, who has a slight idea that his nephew may have plans for the throne, stays watching him. We also meet Red Horse in this chapter, who is quite an anarchist. He expresses his view on the government by basically saying that there should be no type of governing body at all, in fact he says all governments are monstrously evil. He believes that by ridding ourselves of the governments and the law enforcers, we commit an act of creation. -julian
we learn about politics with wealtheows 14 year old nephew. he believes that government are frustrating. he realizes that some3 qualities grendal has hrothulf has too. he believes that government shouldn't exist. ~Osgood
This is the first chapter that is not mostly focused on Grendel. It is mostly about the character Hrothulf, who doesn’t appear in the original tale. Hrothulf is a quiet, intelligent, and dangerous character. As the chapter progresses, we learn about him and the silent threat he poses to Hrothgar. Hrothulf is Hrothgar’s nephew, and so Hrothgar is bound to take him in regardless of him already having male heirs. Hrothulf is accompanied by his counselor, Red Horse. Red Horse is proof of the dragon’s point that humans spend too much time worrying about their little ideas and ideals, as the entirety of his conversation is spent musing on government. What I find interesting are the comparisons between Hrothulf and Grendel. They are both quiet, but they are also completely opposite in another regard. Hrothulf is secretly dangerous, and Grendel is outwardly dangerous but inwardly smart.
ReplyDelete-George
Two points from Red Horse’s speech I find connect with Grendel.
ReplyDeleteFirst, Red Horse says that all one must do is remove the morals and values from a man, and thus, he is corrupted. The same happened with Grendel when he had his first encounter with humans, coming to the realization that they will never be on the same side. He loses the value of friendship, and switches into lone attacker mode. His “human” values are gone, and he has been changed forever. He has switched to the dark side.
Second, Red Horse states that the star citizens of a kingdom are treated well for their perfect fit into the society. Those who cannot conform are driven into “the darkest corners of the kingdom.” Grendel does not fit in among the humans, and thus, he is pushed into the darkest corners of his mind.
—Haven
8. This chapter takes a different turn in the form of describing the current kingdom. There is a character that is brought up in this chapter known as Hrothulf. He hasn’t been shown in the original Beowulf story, but he is shown as the nephew of Hrothgar the current king. This character is shown as a wimpy child who isn’t even old enough to have hair on his lip. He’s shy and quiet, but inside he is a large threat to the kingdom. Since he is family, Hrothgar would be more than happy to take him in, it could spell trouble for the other people in line to receive the throne when Hrothgar is to old to run the kingdom, and with that it could change they why society is run in this place, and it could take a turn for the worst. Hrothgar is an old and simple man and he knows that governments are monstrously evil wen put into the wrong hands. This could happen if he turns the kingdom over to Hrothulf. I also see similarities between Grendel and Hrothulf. Grendel and he are opposites, but harbor similar qualities. Grendel is a force to be reckoned with due to his physical prowess and evil nature displayed to all, but on the inside he’s not a total beast with still some regard to human life. Hrothulf is a wimp who’s scrawny and young and probably couldn’t take on anyone in a fight. He is quite and soft spoken on the outside, but on the inside he’s a landmine ready to explode, due to his dislike of Hrothgar’s way to rule a kingdom. Grendel and Hrothulf are like two sides of the same coin. Regardless how you flip this coin, you will always get some form of evil, but will it be in the form of a beast? Or of a man?
ReplyDelete~Ben Moseley
“Politics is a dirty business.” We all have heard this phrase or seen it somewhere in our lives, well, for Red Horse quite literally being a dirty hobo he speaks the ruthless truth about politics. Red Horse seems to be the typical crazy old man, but he is in fact quite the opposite. This homeless man is quite wise and understands a lot more about the how the government works than the Average Joe. Governments claim that what they do is for the common good, but in reality the government is used to keep those in power or of a high status in power and keep everyone else at a lower level. He also stated that “…those who have the power of the state stands above the society, regulating it…keeping it in the bounds of order…” or bounds of the “norm”. But those who try to retaliate or do not conform to our ideas of order are cast out, arrested, or executed. This could be exactly linked to our monster Grendel. We have been taught since a young age that monsters are bad, dangers; they do not comply with our idea of normal or order. In fact monsters, like Grendel, are exactly the opposite their physical appearance is abnormal and usually if one encounters a dangerous demon the resulting action would generally not be considered order; Grendel breaking and trashing the mead hall. But why do we find these monsters to be so bad? If we were taught that monsters were in fact good, then Grendel could have possibly taken a different road in life, he does always beg for mercy and forgiveness. It would be easy to give a human, something we consider normal, forgiveness, but since we perceive monsters as bad creatures we would never forgive them. Monsters are not normal, they could be, but we do not give them the chance. Why is that? It is because the government teaches us, essentially, that these beings are bad and we will always see them as bad, because we are hardwired to. Since theses monsters are not normal we do not feel that they belong with us. We reward those “who fit the System best… but those who don’t fit…are driven to the darkest corners of the kingdom…” Since Grendel does not fit the government’s ideal of normal, he does not fit in at all. So we drive him and the other demons to the farthest part of the kingdom. The government is a monster, worst than Grendel, deciding who and who does not fit our “bill” of order. I guess the government, Hrothgar, and Grendel aren’t so different after all.
ReplyDelete~Shelby
Chapter 8 has more a political side then any other chapter we have read. In this chapter we are introduced to Red Horse and Hothulf. Red horse talks about how the government is evil. He says that if there were to be a revolution it would be the way the system is because it’s not fair. He didn’t understand how a thief stealing bread would die versus a person how killed someone would not be punished. This mad him furious it didn’t make sense. He states that violence is the way they are ruled but it’s not effective in his opinion
ReplyDeleteIn this chapter, a new character is introduce. His name is Hrothulf, Hrothgar's niece. Hrothulf meets an old man in a forest that goes by the nickname Red Dragon. Red Dragon tells Hrothulf about how the government is corrupted and lies, since they need the people in the state in order to keep their power. Hrothulf and the old man are like Grendel and the dragon. The old man states that people or too conscious on the little things and Hrothulf relates to Grendel since they are both dangerous, but intelligent. On the other hand, Hrothgar's kingdom is in a tiny crisis right now because everyone fears him for his cowardliness, when he did not choose to help Wealtheow while Grendel was attacking.
ReplyDeleteIn this chapter, we meet Hrothulf, Grendel’s nephew and the Red Dragon. The Red Dragon seems like a crazy old man, but really he know the truth about politics and government, explaining how evil they are and about how they lie, saying they do things for the good of all but really they only benefit those in power. Hrothulf agrees with the onl man and can also see the evil of government and power. This worries Hrothgar, however he cannot get rid of his dead brothers son. The red dragon is similar to the dragon because he sees the truth of everything and that everything is corrupt. Hrothulf can compare to Grendel because like Grendel he sees the evil in power but is shy yet dangerous. Hrothgar also fears of both Grendel and Hrothulf attacking.
ReplyDeleteHrothulf has appeared with his extremely unique ideas at Hart and after his father was killed, Hrothgar and Wealtheow take him in as one of their own. Hrothulf changed the community of the Scyldings because of the new forms of political knowledge he brought, his goal was to change the inequality of power. “Freedom for the winners and enslavement of the rest” was a statement said by the old man, which Hrothulf extremely disagrees with. Instead, he believes that both the working class and ruling class are alike. He thinks that the Scyldings are built off of violence and still have not changed. This has to do with Grendel because Hrothulf, just like Grendel, is alone and annoyed with the world they live in. Both of them are searching for reasons with evidence that will explain the problems with the world. In addition, Hrothulf and Red Horse are similar to the relationship between Grendel and the dragon. Both of their mentors seem to always be a step ahead of them and enjoy mocking them.
ReplyDeleteMetztli Garcia
Chapter 8 introduces us to Hrothulf, Hrothgar’s nephew, and Red Horse. Red Horse is an old man who doesn’t seems crazy but in reality knows a lot. He speaks about the truth of politics and how the government works. He describes it as very evil and explains to Grendel how corrupt things are and some of the lies that are thrown around. Red Horse has a lot of knowledge on things but that doesn’t mean he has control over them. Just like Grendel Hrothulf knows more than everyone thinks he does and is trying to find explanations as to why things are the way they are. Neither of them enjoy the conditions and circumstances they are put through. Also, they each have a someone who knows more than they do and feeds them with information.
ReplyDeleteStephanie Medina
Obviously, Grendel is far more poetic in this chapter than in any of the previous ones. We see that he writes scenes as if they are for movies, and the structure and wording of many paragraphs are written to be poetry. Again, Grendel is crazy. He keeps teeter-tottering between nihilism and emotion-driven actions. Although Grendel is very poetic in the beginning of chapter 8, he goes back to his normal descriptions of his depressing life. After he stopped being poetic, Grendel introduced Hrothulf (Hrothgar's nephew), and his old peasant of a friend, Red Horse. At first, Red Horse comes off as a socialist while speaking to Hrothulf, but he instead began commenting on the evil nature of all governments. As an anarchist, I don't see how he spends his time at the side of one of the King's family members. Why is he so close to the evil government?
ReplyDeleteSebastian
Grendel has been moved. Not only does the create a story (if he does so in the first place) but he appears to be expressing sympathy for one that broke his definition of human. Grendel is insane, as I have mentioned before, and thus writes these scenes perhaps to try out what Shaper really did. Shaper mixed past and present in what seemed like truth and, this is why the chapter is quite interesting, creating confusion. Is this the truth? It does seem like it with the brief history before the actual story but even if the characters were real, did this scene take place? Did the characters act as portrayed? Grendel has dabbled in storytelling and come up with something from his imagination based off of past or complete fabrication. Later in the story, Red Horse, a peasant, speaks to Hrothulf of government and, somewhat not surprisingly, despises all forms of government. As Grendel does not know of government and simply sees it as a human construct which they are quite obsessed with, he finds all of them evil, thus sticking to his role.
ReplyDelete-Cameron
DeleteThe stogie introduces us to Red Horse and Hrothulf. Hrothulf is the ambitious nephew of Hrothgar and Red Horse is an anarchist who believes all governments are evil. Red Horse is trying to explain to Hrothulf how states are evil.
ReplyDelete-Evan
In this chapter, Grendel’s poetic side shows up more than in another chapter. He starts off with pages of very detailed and movie like, epic scenes which helps people from the time of similar movies and television, which truly helps modern readers to relate. As usual, Grendel is stalking Hrothgar and his people and becomes very confused angry and baffled by the politics that are brought up by Hrothgar’s nephew and a peasant. Hrothulf believes are very altered by the conversation with red horse. Red horse comes off as a socialist but brings up the idea that even the principle of a government is evil and punishing. This goes against all that Hrothulf knows and believes and is outraged by the end of the conversation.
ReplyDeleteAdam
In chapter eight of “Grendel”, Grendel watches the development of Hrothgar’s nephew, Hrothulf. Hrothulf is a quiet and aloof person, not very interactive with his peers or adult acquaintances, and has lost his father. He is also not as easily tricked by the songs of shapers, and constantly seeks to answer questions about the world and stretches to find the truth behind social constructs of his nation. These characteristics are related to Grendel’s in many ways. Grendel is also not very interactive with other creatures or human beings, and has no father apparent in his life. Both Grendel and Hrothulf seek knowledge and answers to the questions they ponder in their spare time. When Hrothulf is lectured by the blind peasant “Red Horse”, he becomes certain in viewpoint that Hrothgar’s government system is corrupt. Similar to Grendel he is not persuaded by the shapers to believe in Hrothgar’s greatness, or of the nobility of Hrothgar’s heroic thanes. Instead he and Red Horse believe that the Hrothgar’s institution, which holds a monopoly on the violence, army, and police work of the nation, uses that power to keep those at the top of the hierarchy in a position of legitimacy for whatever actions they choose to make. They use this power to push those who are not welcome in the upper class into a state of oppression. Peasants at the bottom who happen call out for justice or civil liberty are easily imprisoned or executed because the state holds this monopoly over “legitimate violence”. Red horse and Hrothulf differ in opinion of the state of “all” government systems being corrupt. Hrothulf agrees that Hrothgar’s system is corrupt, but he believes under his own rule the nation could become prosperous and equal for all people. Since Hrothulf would become the new heir to the king once his cousins, Hrothgar’s sons, die, he plans to frame the accidental death of Hrothgar’s sons so that he could become king after Hrothgar. He would then establish his envisioned liberal and cooperative nation. While Grendel does not have plans to become king over Heorot, it is possible that he would kill Grendel’s sons to disprove the shaper’s ideas of a strong kingdom. Additionally, it is possible that Grendel may be against Hrothulf’s plans to overthrow Hrothgar because Grendel would then lose his identity as Hrothgar’s bane. We know that Hrothulf does not live through the story of Beowulf, and that Hrothgar has to rule over his nation for many years past the defeat of Grendel, so something must arise that stops Hrothulf from succeeding in his plans. -David
ReplyDeleteRed horse and Hrothgar's nephew Hrothulf in this chapter are the most important political figure that we have seen yet. The political concepts, anarchy and Revolution are important in this chapter because all kingdoms are mostly ruled by violence which is not an effective strategy that the continue to participate in.
ReplyDeleteHow does this affect Grendel? Well depending on two options Hrothulf has, Grendel will either go home with less meat (by eating hrothulf) or go home with more meat (hrothgar is fat right?) The book has stated a few many times that Grendel is what defines the people in heorot, therefore what he does to either hrothulf or hrothgar or any of the royal family will affect what happens to the kingdom, this gives Grendel a definition, finally his life can move on......oh.....actually, Grendel is to stupid to realize his life is what he makes it, that old dragon put it into his head that the world would end anyway and it didn't matter what he did so now Grendel clings to that, and any sort of philosophic notion like a star wars nerd clinging to a lightsaber. In short, Grendel is not affected by this really as he has no ties to the kingdom, the only thing it would give him is time to ponder, but nooo, Grendel wouldn't do that since he's so set on not caring at all.
ReplyDelete-aLeX
Dear Amy,
ReplyDeleteIn Chapter 8, Grendel starts to act like the shaper in his poetic narrations. Grendel begins his narrations by acting out and breaking apart the book into small scenes. It all starts when Halga the Good, younger brother of Hrothgar dies. Halga's son, Hrothulf, the nephew of Hrothgar, at 14 years old, is already a pretender to Hrothgar's throne, and kingdom. Hrothulf is described by Grendel as a small scorpion. A scorpion is a small, stealthy, and has a poisonous bite. Hrothulf is the scorpion and he is more dangerous than he looks. Grendel sees the low class praying to the king, saying "long live the king", "To whom we owe all joy"! Grendel scoffs at this by asking himself why does the bread thief die and the murdering thanes get to escape? Why does the murderer get to escape and live, when the bread thief was killed by the government (executed), since he stole bread because he was hungry. This is the first sign of corruption in government according to Grendel. Gremdel compares the government as a tree. And a tree is a tyrant because it casts a shadow o the ground, and outcompetes the other plants. Another time, Grendel observes from Queen Wealtheow that she is worried that Hrothulf and her babes will fight over the kingdom because of blood rights. Grenades sees that Wealtheow is worried that Hrothgar will not be close to his children, and he will give the throne to Hrothulf. In conclusion, Hrothulf and Grendel are both lonely and want to be important, want to have a purpose, a meaning in life, and a reason to live for.
Sincerely,
Dylan
Part 2
ReplyDeleteMeanwhile, Hrothuf who wants to become the king of Hrothgar's kingdom, seeks Red Horse, an old man for help on how he can gat to be king/ Red Horse tells him he has to believe in violence, in order to succeed. And in a revolution, you need to believe in violence. Because Red Horse tells him, if we have a revolution, we will realize what our actions had done. Red Horse gives an example to Hrothulf,about religion which tears something apart and creates in its replacement something new. John Grendel alludes this to people murdering each other over religion. As Red Horse, says violence is the answer if Hrothulf wants to become king, because it will get him to where he wants to be. Red Horse explains to Hrothulf that a kingdom protects the power of the government and prevents people from revolting. The government's power is to be keep people in content and from rising to the government. Red Horse explains to him that revolution is just violence, winners win, and losers get enslaved. A State is all about violence. Red Horse believes all government are evil. Hrothulf wants to make things even between people. And that violence is not the answer only violence should be allowed for the people's own good. ("the ends justify the means"). While Red Horse says only violence can change a government. While Grendel watching this feels pleasure, and enjoys the violence grow in Hrothulf. However, Hrothulf who wants to be king, still is nice to Hrothgar's children. Hrothulf is described to be a moody, lonely you man, afraid of strangers, and awkward with the adults he knew well. While Hrothgar is getting older, Wealtheow worries of Hrothulf becoming king instead of her children, realizing that Hrothulf and Hygmond all want to be king. However Grendel notes that Hrothgar will always be his target even though he is getting older and weaker by day. After all, Grendel is satisfied that he has won the battle against Hrothgar. Grendel proves he is a coward after trying to take away Wealtheow, while Hrothgar sits there without helping his wife. Grendel also finds himself to be satisfied because he is the condition in which they thrive. Grendel had created the humans, he says, after all what were the humans be without him? Would Hrothgar be the king he is without Grendel? In the end of the chapter, Grendel dreams that he and Hrothgar are represented as two trees. Grendel and Hrothgar are like the two trees entwined, they need each other to survive. Grendel needs Hrothgar to have purpose in life. While Hrothgar needs Grendel to be the man the Shaper tells tales, cites poems, and sings songs about. Therefore Hrothgar wouldn't haven an illusiion as a brave king he is without Grendel, and Grendel will not me the monster, the wrecker of medals without Hrothgar as his target. In conclusion, they all need each other, and both Grendel and Hrothgar are essential to each of his owns purpose.
Sincerely,
Dylan
When Hrothgar’s brother, Halga, is murdered, Halga’s fourteen-year-old son, Hrothulf, comes to live at Hart. By this time, Hrothgar and Wealtheow have two sons of their own. Hrothulf, though polite, is sullen and withdrawn. Hrothgar tries to attribute the boy’s malaise to the trauma of losing his father, but he also suspects that the boy may be plotting against him. Grendel confirms this when he spies on Hrothulf and Red Horse in the forest.
ReplyDeleteAt this time, Hrothgar, who has just begun raising two kids with his new wife, Wealtheow, takes in his fourteen-year-old nephew, Hrothulf, who comes off as mannerly and civil, but may have sinister plans. While Grendel is observing Hrothulf, he notices some of the qualities present in Hrothulf's behaviors reflect qualities in his behaviors. Hrothgar, who has a slight idea that his nephew may have plans for the throne, stays watching him. We also meet Red Horse in this chapter, who is quite an anarchist. He expresses his view on the government by basically saying that there should be no type of governing body at all, in fact he says all governments are monstrously evil. He believes that by ridding ourselves of the governments and the law enforcers, we commit an act of creation.
ReplyDelete-julian
we learn about politics with wealtheows 14 year old nephew. he believes that government are frustrating. he realizes that some3 qualities grendal has hrothulf has too. he believes that government shouldn't exist.
ReplyDelete~Osgood